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THE Narrative & Reaſons Of the Honorable Houſe of COMMONS, Concerning the TRYAL of the LORDS IN THE TOWER. Delivered at a CONFERENCE WITH The LORDS, May, 26th. 1679.

London, Printed in the Year, 1679.

1

THE Narrative & Reaſons Of the Honorable HOUSE of COMMONS, Concerning the Tryal of the LORDS in the Tower, &c.

THE Commons have always deſired, that a good Correſpondence may be preſerved between Both Houſes. There is now depending between Your Lordſhips, and the Commons, a Matter of the greateſt Weight; In the Tranſaction of which, Your Lordſhips ſeem to apprehend ſome Difficulty in the Matter propoſed by the Commons.

To clear this, the Commons have deſired this Confe­rence; and by it, they hope to manifeſt to You Lord­ſhips,2 that the Propoſitions of the Houſe of Commons, made by their Committee, in Relation to the Tryal of the Lords in the Tower, have been only ſuch as are well warranted by the Laws of Parliament, and Conſtituti­on of the Government, and in no ſort Intrench upon the Judicature of the Peers: But are moſt neceſſary to be inſiſted upon, that the Antient Rights of Judicature in Parliament, may be maintained.

The Commons readily acknowledge, that the Crimes charged upon the Earl of Powis, &c. are of deep Guilt, and call for ſpeedy Juſtice: But withal, they hold a­ny Change in Judicature in Parliment, made without Conſent in full Parliament, to be of Pernicious Conſe­quence both to His Majeſty, and his Subjects: And conceive themſelves obliged to tranſmit to their Poſte­rity, all the Rights, which of this Kind they have Re­ceived from their Anceſtors, by putting Your Lordſhips in mind, of the Progreſs that hath already been be­tween the Two Houſes, in Relation to the Propoſitions made by the Commons, and the Reaſonableneſs of the Propoſitions themſelves: They doubt not, to make it appear, that their Aim has been no other than to a­voyd ſuch Conſequences, and to preſerve that Right; And that there is no Delay of Juſtice on their Part. And to that end, do offer to Your Lordſhips the enſuing Reaſons and Narrative, that the Commons, in bringing the Earl of Danby to Juſtice, and in the Diſcovery of the Execrable and Traiterous Conſpiracy, (of which the Five Popiſh Lords now ſtand Impeached; and for which, ſome of their Wicked Accomplices have already un­dergone the Sentence of the Law, as Traitors and Mur­therers) have labour'd under many great Difficulties, is not unknown to Your Lordſhips: Nor is it leſs known3 to Your Lordſhips, that upon the Impeachment of the Houſe of Commons againſt the Earl of Danby for High Treaſon, and other High Crimes, Miſdemeanors, and Offences, even the Common Juſtice, of Sequeſtring him from Parliament, and forth-with Committing him to ſafe Cuſtody, was then Required by the Commons, and Denyed by the Houſe of Peers; though he then Sate in Their Houſe: Of which, Your Lordſhips have been ſo ſenſible, that at a Free Conference the Twelfth of A­pril, laſt, Your Lordſhips declared, That it was the Right of the Commons, and well warranted by Preſidents of former Ages; That upon an Impeachment of the Com­mons, a Peer ſo Impeached, ought of Right to be or­dered to with-draw, and then to be Committed: And had not that Juſtice been denyed to the Commons, a great Part of this Seſſion of Parliament, which hath been ſpent in Framing and Adjuſting a Bill, for cauſing the Earl of Danby to Appear, and Anſwer that Juſtice from which he was fled, had been ſaved; and had been imployed for the Preſervation of His Majeſties Per­ſon, and the Security of the Nation, and in Proſecu­ting the other five Lords. Neither had he had the Op­portunity of Procuring for himſelf, that Illegal Pardon, which bears Date the Firſt of March, laſt paſt; and which he hath now Pleaded in Barr of his Impeach­ment: Nor of waſting ſo great a Proportion of the Treaſure of the Kingdome, as he hath done ſince the Commons Exhibited their Articles of Impeachment a­gainſt him. After which time, thus loſt by reaſon of the Denyal of that Juſtice, which of Right belonged to the Commons, upon their Impeachment; The ſaid Bill being ready for the Royal Aſſent, the ſaid Earl rendred himſelf; and by Your Lordſhips Order of the Six­teenth4 of April, laſt, was Committed to the Tower: After which, he pleaded the ſaid Pardon; and being preſt, did at length declare, That he would Rely up­on, and abide by that Plea. Which Pardon pleaded, being Illegal and Voyd; and ſo, ought not to bar or preclude the Commons, from having Juſtice upon their Impeachment. They did there-upon (with their Spea­ker, on the Fifth of May, Inſtant, in the Name of them­ſelves, and of all the Commons of England) demand Judgment againſt the ſaid Earl, upon their Impeachment; not doubting, but that Your Lordſhips did intend, in all Your proceedings upon the Impeachments, to follow the uſual Courſe and Method of Parliament; but the Commons were not a little Surpriſed by the Meſſage from your Lordſhips, delivered them on the ſeventh of May, thereby Acquainting them, that as well the Lords Spiritual as Temporal, had ordered the tenth of May Inſtant, ſhould be the day for hearing the Earl of Danby, to make good his Plea of his Pardon; and that on the thirteenth of May, the other five Lords Impeached, ſhould be brought to their Tryal; and that your Lordſhips had Addreſſed to his Majeſty for Naming of a High-Steward, as well in the Caſe of the Earl of Danby, as the other five Lords; upon Conſideration of the ſaid Meſſage, the Commons found that the Admitting the Lords Spiritual to exer­ciſe Juriſdiction in theſe Caſes, was an Alteration of the Judicature in Parliament; and which extended as well to the Proceedings againſt the five Lords as the Earl of Danby; and that if a Lord High Stew­ard ſhould be Neceſſary, upon Tryals or Impeach­ments of the Commons, the power of Judicature in Parliament upon Impeachments, might be Defeated5 by ſuſpending or denying a Commiſſion to Conſtitute a Lord High Steward, and that the ſaid days of Try­al appointed by your Lordſhips, were ſo near to the time of your ſaid Meſſage, that theſe matters, and the Methods of Proceedings upon the Tryals, could not be Adjuſted by Conference between the two Houſes before the day ſo Nominated; and Conſequently the Commons could not then Proceed to Tryal, unleſs the Zeal which they had for ſpeedy Judgment againſt the Earl of Danby, that ſo they might proceed to the Tryal of the other five Lords, ſhould Induce them at this Juncture, both to Admit an enlargment of your Lordſhips Juriſdiſdiction, and ſit down under theſe or any hardſhips (though with the hazard of all the Com­mons Power of Impeaching for the time to come) ra­ther than the Tryal of the ſaid five Lords ſhould be deferred for ſome ſhort time, whilſt theſe matters might be agreed and on ſetled; for Reconciling differences in theſe great and weighty matters, and for ſaving that time which would neceſſarily have been ſpent in de­bates, at Conferences between the Two Houſes, and for Expediting the Tryals, without giving up the Po­wer of Impeachments, or rendring them ineffectu­al, the Commons thought fit to propoſe to your Lord­ſhips, that a Committee of both Houſes might be ap­pointed for this purpoſe; at which Committee, when agreed to by your Lordſhips, it was firſt propoſed, that the time of the Tryal of the Lords in the Tower, ſhould be put off till the other matters were Adjuſted; and it was then agreed, That the propoſition as to the time of Tryal, ſhould be the laſt thing Conſidered; and the Effect of this agreement, ſtands reported upon your Lordſhips Books; after which, the Commons Communi­cated6 to your Lordſhips by your Committee, a Vote of theirs, viz. That the Committee of Commons, ſhould Inſiſt upon the former Vote of their Houſe, that the Lords Spiritual ought not to have any Vote in any pro­ceedings againſt the Lords in the Tower; and that when that matter ſhould be ſetled, and the method of pro­ceedings Adjuſted, the Commons would then be ready to proceed upon the Tryal of the Pardon of the Earl of Danby; againſt whom, they had before demanded Judgment; and afterwards to the Tryal of the other five Lords in the Tower: which Vote Extended as well to the Earl of Danby, as the other five Lords: but the Com­mons have as yet received nothing from your Lordſhips towards an Anſwer to that Vote; ſave that your Lord­ſhips have acquainted them, that the Biſhops have Asked leave of the Houſe of Peers, that they might withdraw them­ſelves from the Tryal of the ſaid five Lords, with Li­berty of entring their uſual proteſtation: And though the Commons Committee, have almoſt dayly declared to your Lordſhips Committee; that that was a neceſſary point of Right to be ſettled, before the Trials; and of­fered to Debate the ſame, your Committee always An­ſwered, that they had not any Power from your Lord­ſhips, either to Confer upon, or to Give any Anſwer concerning that Matter.

And yet Your Lordſhips, without having given the Commons any ſatisfactory Anſwer to the ſaid Vote, or permitting any Conference or Debate there-upon, and contrary to the ſaid Agreement, did on Thurſday the Twenty-Fourth of May, ſend a Meſſage to the Commons, declaring, That the Lords Spiritual, as well as Temporal, had ordered, That the Twenty-Seventh of this Inſtant May be appointed for the Tryal of the five Lords.

7So that the Commons cannot but apprehend your Lordſhips have not only departed from what was a­greed on, and in Effect laid aſide that Committee Con­ſtituted for Preſerving a good Underſtanding be­twixt the two Houſes, and better Diſpatch of the weighty Affairs now Depending in Parliament, but muſt alſo needs conclude from the ſaid Meſſage, and from the Vote of your Lordſhips of the 14th. of May, That the Lords Spiritual have a Right to ſtay and ſit in Court till the Court proceeds to Guilty or not Guilty, and from the Biſhops asking leave (as appears by the Lords Books) two days after the ſaid Vote that they might withdraw themſelves from the Tryal of the five Lords, with Liberty of entering their uſual Proteſtations, and from their perſiſting ſtill to go on & give their Votes in proceeding upon the Impeachments, that their de­ſire of leave to with-draw at the ſaid Tryal, is on­ly an evaſive Anſwer to the forementioned Vote of the Commons, and chiefly intended as an Argument for a right of Judicature upon Proceedings upon Im­peachments; and as a Reſerve to Judge upon the Earl of Danby's Plea of Pardon; and upon theſe and o­ther like Impeachments; although no ſuch Power was ever Claimed by their Predeceſſors, but is utterly de­nied by the Commons.

And the Commons are the rather Induced to believe it ſo intended, becauſe the very asking to withdraw, ſeemes to imply aright to be there, and that, they can­not be abſent without it; becauſe by this way they would have it in their Power, whether or no for the Future, either in the Earl of Danby's Caſe or any other, they will ever ask Leave to be Abſent, and the8 Temporal Lords have like Power of Denying Leave, if that ſhall be Admitted once neceſſary.

The Commons are therefore Obliged not to pro­ceed to the Tryal of the five Lords the twenty ſe­venth of this inſtant May, but to adhere to their a­fore-ſaid Vote. And for their ſo doing, beſides, what hath been now and formerly by them ſaid to your Lordſhips, do offer you theſe Reaſons following.

9

THE REASONS.

1. BEcauſe your Lordſhips have Received the Earl of Danby's Plea of Pardon, with a very long and unuſual Proteſtation; wherein he hath Aſpers'd his Majeſty with falſe Suggeſtion, as if his Majeſty had Commanded or Countenanced the Crimes he ſtands Charged with: And particularly, Suppreſſing and Diſ­couraging the Diſcovery of the Plot; and en­deavouring to Introduce an Arbitrary and Ty­rannical way of Government: which remains as a Scandal upon Record, againſt his Majeſty; tending to render his Perſon and Government odious to his People. Againſt which, it ought to be the Firſt and Principal Care of Both Hou­ſes, to Vindicate his Majeſty, by doing Juſtice a­gainſt the ſaid Earl.

2. The ſetting up a Pardon to be a Bar of an Impeachment, defeats the whole Uſe and Effects of Impeachments: And ſhould this Point be admitted, or ſtand doubted, it would total­ly diſcourage the Exhibiting any for the Future;10 whereby the Chief Inſtitution for the Preſerva­tion of the Government, (and conſequently, the Government it ſelf) would be deſtroyed. And therefore, the Caſe of the ſaid Earl, which in Conſequence concerns all Impeachments what­ever, ought to be determined before that of the five Lords, which is but their particular Caſe, and without reſorting to many Authorities of greater Antiquity. The Commons deſire your your Lordſhips, to take Notice (with the ſame Regard they do) of the Declaration, which that Excellent Prince, King Charles the Firſt, of Bleſ­ſed Memory, made in this behalf, in his An­ſwer to the Nineteenth Propoſition of Both Houſes of Parliament: Wherein, ſtating the ſeveral Parts of this Regulated Monarchy, he ſayes, The King, the Houſe of Lords, and the Houſe of Commons, have (each) particular Priviledges: And among thoſe which belong to the King, he reckons Power of Pardons. After the Enumerating of which, and other his Prerogatives, his ſaid Ma­jeſty adds thus: Again, That the Prince may not make uſe of this high and perpetual Power, to the Hurt of thoſe for whoſe Good he hath it; and make uſe of the Name of Publick Neceſſity, for the Gain of his private Favourites and Followers, to the Detriment of his People; The Houſe of Commons (an Excellent11 Conſerver of Liberty) is ſolely intruſted with the Firſt Propoſitions, concerning the Leavyes of Moneys, and the Impeaching of thoſe, who for their own Ends, (though Countenanced by any Surreptitiouſly-gotten Command of the King) have Violated that Law, which he is bound (when he knows it) to Protect: And to the Protecti­on of which, they were bound to adviſe him; at leaſt not to ſerve him in the contrary. And the Lords, be­ing truſted with a Judicatory Power, are an excellent Skreen and Banke, between the Prince and People, to aſſiſt each againſt any Encroachments of the o­ther; and by juſt Judgment, to Preſerve that Law which ought to be the Rule of every One of the Three, &c. Therefore, the Power legally placed in Both Houſes, is more than Sufficient, to prevent and reſtrain the Power of Tyranny, &c.

3. Until the Commons of England have right down them againſt this Plea of Pardon, they may Juſtly apprehend that the whole Juſ­tice of the Kingdome, in the Caſe of the Lords may be Obſtructed, and defeated by pardons of like Nature.

4. An Impeachment is Virtually the voice of every particular Subject of this Kingdome Crying out againſt an Oppreſſion, by which e­very member of that body is equally wounded; and it will prove a matter of ill Conſequence,12 that the Univerſality of the People ſhould have Occaſion Miniſtred and Continued to them, to be Apprehenſive of utmoſt danger from the Crown, from whence they of right expect pro­tection.

5. The Commons Exhibited Articles of Im­peachments againſt the ſaid Earl, before any a­gainſt the five other Lords, and demanded Judgement upon thoſe Articles; whereupon your Lordſhips having appointed the Tryal of the ſaid Earl, to be before that of the other five Lords; now your Lordſhips having ſince in­verted that Order, gives a great Cauſe of doubt to the Houſe of Commons, and raiſes a Jea­louſie in the hearts of all the Commons of England; that if they ſhould proceed to the Try­al of the five Lords in the firſt place, not on­ly Juſtice will be Obſtructed in the Caſe of thoſe Lords; but that they ſhall never have right done them in the matter of this Plea of Pardon, which is of ſo fatal Conſequence to the whole Kingdome, and a New deviſe to fruſtrate publick Juſtice in Parliament.

Which Reaſons and Matters being duely weighed by your Lordſhips, the Commons doubt not but your Lordſhips will receive Sa­•••••ction concerning their propoſitions and pro­ceedings;13 and will agree, that the Commons ought not, nor can without deſerting their Truſt, depart from their former Vote, Communicated to your Lordſhips: That the Lords Spiritual ought not to have any Vote in any proceedings againſt the Lords in the Tower; and when that matter ſhall be ſetled, and the Methods of proceedings Adjuſted, the Commons ſhall then be Ready to proceed upon the Tryal of the Pardon of the Earl of Danby, (againſt whom they have already demanded Judgment) and afterwards to the Tryal of the other Five Lords in the Tower.

This is a true Copy carefully examined, and publiſhed to prevent abuſes by falſe ones.

FINIS.

About this transcription

TextThe narrative & reasons of the Honorable House of Commons, concerning the tryal of the Lords in the Tower Delivered at a conference with the Lords, May, 26th. 1679.
AuthorEngland and Wales. Parliament. House of Commons..
Extent Approx. 19 KB of XML-encoded text transcribed from 9 1-bit group-IV TIFF page images.
Edition1679
SeriesEarly English books online.
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(EEBO-TCP ; phase 2, no. A83747)

Transcribed from: (Early English Books Online ; image set 132691)

Images scanned from microfilm: (Early English books, 1641-1700 ; 2515:22)

About the source text

Bibliographic informationThe narrative & reasons of the Honorable House of Commons, concerning the tryal of the Lords in the Tower Delivered at a conference with the Lords, May, 26th. 1679. Proceedings. 1679-05-26 England and Wales. Parliament. House of Commons., England and Wales. Parliament. House of Lords.. [2], 13, [1] p. [s.n.],London :printed in the year, 1679.. (Regarding the pardon of the Thomas Osborne, Earl of Danby (later Duke of Leeds), and the trial of the five lords: Earl of Powis, Viscount Stafford, Lord Petre, Lord Arundel of Wardour, and Lord Bellasis.) (Reproduction of original in the Folger Shakespeare Library.)
Languageeng
Classification
  • Leeds, Thomas Osborne, -- Duke of, 1631-1712 -- Early works to 1800.
  • Popish Plot, 1678 -- Early works to 1800.
  • Treason -- England -- Early works to 1800.
  • Great Britain -- History -- Charles II, 1660-1685 -- Early works to 1800.

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